Competition - feedback

[Hyokenseisou]

Don't know if this was the right place or not, but I'm gonna voice my opinions strongly on this...

First off, let me just say congrats to all the winners and thank you to Andrew to organizing this.

Secondly, I'm not saying this out of spite or poor sportsmanship or whatever, but merely from my observations.... I've lost before, I can take it, I'm a big girl, losing is part of life.
Also not meant to start a flame war or anything like that.


While I may have been new to entering in live animals and the art aspect of THIS contest, I am certainly not new to contests as a whole. I have competed in many costume contests, both on the winning and losing side. I also have a LONG history of running said type costume contests and other somewhat related contests.
With that said, from my past history of both running and competing in them, the judging aspect of this particular contest I found to be VERY flawed....

When I host a contest, I have categories for a reason. People can pick and chose what they want to enter (ie, Best Costume, Best Skit, Best Group, Best in Show - then from there 1st/2nd/3rd in each). And when someone wins, they win in THAT category, not an overall '1st/2nd/3rd/etc'.... Had I have known that, I would not have competed... There was no define seperation between the said categories by the end results, they were just all mashed into together.
Also, if some chose to compete in several categories, they are chose to win in only ONE of those, not multiple, regardless of how well they did in the others; they are picked to win the one they won the best in.

And having won 'Best in Show' (which is the top of the line/best of the best category) twice at two separate conventions, if and whenever I DO win that year at which ever convention, regardless of WHAT place or WHAT category, I make a point not to compete the following year; so to give a chance to new comers and let someone else stand in the spot light and experience the joy and glory of winning.
Honestly, I don't think it's very fair for people who have already won, especially in a certain category, to be competing again in the same one the following year.
It's very discouraging to know that "X" person as won "X" place in "X" category for several years in a row (and with the same entry sometimes). Whenever one of my costumes wins something, I don't ever enter that costume in another contest again; it's won, it's had it's glory, it's over, on to the next costume.
I did not expect to win, but at the same time, I didn't expect my drawing to be on the same playing field as an indigo who's won multiple times, or a gecko against a kid's trifold, in the end.
(The above underlined statement is pretty much the jist of what I'm trying to get at....)



I'd like to compete again in future contests, but honestly, I'm scared and don't want to... If it's going to be the same judging system, I don't think I'd stand a chance because everything is just going to get mashed up into one overall category again. But if there was a clear line between each category and people won for what they entered specifically and not just as an overall whole, than I'd consider it. aka award based on category, not overall score in the overall contest...


Thank you for the opportunity of competing and I hope my feedback is taken into consideration for future contests.

[Farva]

If you feel like you can do a better job step up and help Andrew next year. It sounds like you almost want a price cap on animal value? Don't forget the goal of this is to get more people interested and out to the show. We are trying to make it more then just "SALE". Keep in mind we had a low number of entry's so as this gets more popular we can set category better. Bottom line if you want to changing it talking on the forums is going to do nothing. Show up to a meeting on time and voice your opinion there.

I have some issues with the show but this is not the right venue to raise them. So I will be bringing them up at the next meeting.

Edit: With your knowledge what would you change? How would you implement this change? Why are you changing what you are changing? I'm all for feedback but bring something to the table. Don't just say I don't like this change it. You have as much power as Andrew in this society.

[Hyokenseisou]

I would have liked to have gone to the last two meetings, but was busy working. Whenever I can, I do try to make it out.

Sorry, I worded that wrong - It wasn't so much as the actual value of whatever is entered, but so much as using an animals 'rarity' to an advantage... If I were gonna judge an animal, it'd be based off the animal itself on physical traits and not a past history of good speakings.

I'm not necessarily saying I can 'do better', but make it so that it's (for lack of a better word), fair....
And technically, I DID help Andrew... I helped judged the other categories I wasn't entered in.


I don't know, if I've never been to the show before, and this was my first time, and I didn't know any of the people there I do know (to a certain point), and wasn't a member; just some Joe Blow off the street who saw the competition poster and decided to enter - Would I come to show and enter again? No, because had I have known even more ahead of time that people who've already won, are entering again, I definitely would NOT have entered. To me, that speaks poor sportsmanship. Like I said, if you've won before, don't compete in the following year at the least, let other people have a chance to maybe win.
I think that people who've won compete over and over and over again, is actually just going to detour new people entering and or bring in interest to the show. Maybe that's the reason why there was a low number of entries this year??


What I'm trying to get at is, maybe people who've won before, take a year off, and have the awarding system given out based off the certain category and not as a whole (otherwise you might as just make it one big general contest).

[GONESNAKEE]

For the record my male Eastern Indigo has been entered in a total of 3 various TARAS show type contests over the decade? he's been taken there as a display animal over those years.
First one quite a few years back at the Legion & there were public ballots which attendees voted & decided the outcome of the various categories.
He took 2nd for best snake & lost to another snake, a Super Pastel BP of all things LOL
If I recall correctly every snake in the show was "entered" (same for lizards, amphibians etc. all entered, public vote.) & folks just had to name the vendor & the snake to vote, same year I won best table display as well, again decided by those attending naming a vendor display on a ballot, each vendor had a number they used.

As for how everything gets judged now I don't know but both last spring & this spring I entered the male EI into the snake category.
He won best snake both years (that would be twice), beating out other snakes entered.
Having won Best Snake over other snakes entered has nothing to do with any artwork, lizards, pictures, kids stuff etc. just snakes Vs snakes & thus "Best Snake".
Anyhow that said not sure about some of the other "beefs" stated as I don't have a full understanding of the judging other than multiple judges were used & it was a points system which is all laid out in a thread here somewhere I'm sure?
As for enter the male EI next year, probably won't wouldn't want to upset folks, plus I've proved my point 2 years running LOL JOKING! Lots of great snakes out there to see.
Anyhow I'll probably enter a different snake, heck maybe snakes.
Afterall I do have 3 more Indigos I could bring again Joking.
I would enter something different species wise.
Also for the record I did enter my chest & back tattoos last year as well, but won nothing.
Mark

[S & M Exotics]

that indigo was definitely the best in show hands down!!
the brb was cool,
but that indigo was the coolest snake in the whole venue!!

[Farva]

With the animals we want to get vendors with more display type things. For example I had Six animals on my table that were pure display. There is people out there with some cool stuff this is a little incentive to get it out on display.

I will ask this again layout what you want to see changed. How would you implement getting the winner to take a year off(keep in mind we want those animals on display still)? How would you change the Category's? How would you change the award distribution?

Edit to avoid double post: I see Mark entering the EI as a challenge. As in lets see if I can't bring something that will beat it. I'm thinking a king Cobra should be able to eat it no problem. Just joking, but really maybe the Rhino Rat, Maybe the Mandarins, Maybe I need to get a Persian Pied Rat, or Coxi.

[GONESNAKEE]

that indigo was definitely the best in show hands down!!
the brb was cool,
but that indigo was the coolest snake in the whole venue!!

THX Man!

Also on the orginal thread topic I do think it reasonable to be taken into consideration that the previous years best of snake/lizard/ etc./etc. not be eligible to run in the very next years competition, but think they should be allowed in future ones after, Mark

[Hyokenseisou]

Edit: With your knowledge what would you change? How would you implement this change? Why are you changing what you are changing? I'm all for feedback but bring something to the table. Don't just say I don't like this change it. You have as much power as Andrew in this society.

How scoring done: 'bonus' points I feel are really not necessary, have what you're scoring, more category specific, give awards based on that category (ie live anaimal 1, 2, 3, photography, 1, 2, 3, etc, and not just 'overall' 1, 2, 3)
Why change it, because if you're just going to have a contest with "what's the best of the best", then just have a contest that's "best of the best", and not a "hey, enter in these categories but 1st place winner might be snake category, 2nd place winner might be photography, 3rd etc, you never know but try anyways!!"... If you're gonna have categories, USE them and award them accordingly.
Award based on category:
1st place Best Snake - to so and so
2nd place Best Snake - goes to Bob
etc
1st place photography - winner is joe
2nd place photo. - carl
etc.
Not
1st place creative
2nd place maybe vivs??
3rd might be snakes???
There's no consistency in the end results.

I'd like to think I did bring something to the table but that maybe it was overlooked... I named examples of how I run my contests and the reasoning behind it and that maybe this contest could consider a similar method so to give an equal chance for more (new) people to win.

And I really doubt I have as much power as Andrew, he's been in this way longer than I have. But is not the point to get new fresh opinions from new blood?

[S & M Exotics]

werent there other awards for other categories? i saw many different plaques

haven't you seen the dog shows, they have many different categories where you can win a prize and then the main prize is best in show!!

[Farva]

And I really doubt I have as much power as Andrew, he's been in this way longer than I have. But is not the point to get new fresh opinions from new blood?

You do really have the same power as Andrew in this society. You just need to come to meetings on time and voice your opinion. Your vote counts on everything. We need new blood new ideas, that is why I'm trying to get you to develop your ideas and not just tell you I think they suck and to go sit in the corner.

The more people who are actively contributing to the workings of the society the better. I want to hear new ideas, I just want to see people instead of just complaining about what is wrong. Bring your complaints but also bring a solution. I don't care if its a good solution just bring something. That way we can build off it and keep going till we find something that works.